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#1 Dec 28, 2019 7:31 PM

Stormy
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Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

I’m sure I’ve made a thread about this at least once, but it’s been long enough that it would get a new batch of answers this time.

I personally was raised without Santa and preferred it that way. We have also chosen to skip the whole charade with our kids, too. We think it’s a good way to take out some of the commercialization of the holiday, making it less about getting stuff and more about the original, religious meaning. And about gratitude for what you receive instead of just expecting some list to be checked off.

Our son (almost 5 now) was asked several times this Christmas season things like “Did you make a Christmas list for Santa?” “What did Santa bring you?” “Did you get a picture with Santa?” All of which were met either with blank stares of confusion or something along the lines of “no, my mommy and daddy got me presents.” Last year one of our neighbors asked him about Santa and he just said “Um, Santa’s not real.” So slightly more tactful this year, haha.

A lot of people are apparently deeply offended by this and think that not spreading the Santa story takes the “magic” out of Christmas or something. IMO, if your idea of magic relies on a lie, I don’t need magic. Christmas is plenty fun without believing your gifts are coming from a magical source that judges you behavior for the entire year.

What do you guys think?

Does Christmas need Santa?

Yes 25%
No 75%
Undecided/other 0%
Total votes: 4

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#2 Dec 29, 2019 2:15 AM

36IStillLikeSpyro36
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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

my mom raised me on Santa Claus and it... honestly bothered me a lot that my family had lied to me that whole time. and for no good reason. if i were in charge of kids for some reason, i would not raise them on Santa.

the idea that there's "magic" to Christmas is (or at least should be) a very troubling sign of the depths that consumerism has lowered our culture to. look at the world through the eyes of a philosopher/poet/artist -- the world is already full of wonder and amazement. it's just that that wonder and amazement is deemed "archaic" or "mundane" by our (ironically very archaic and mundane) culture. fiction can easily be "magical" without trying to blur the line between it, and reality. (look at the popularity of Lord of the Rings for example!) and the idea that people get offended when a literal lie is called a literal lie just shows how close-minded and ridiculous society has gotten. and what's really sad is how complacent people have been in letting it reach this point. but anyway.




and in a "religious" / theological sense, i fear that a child's mind could easily get confused between simple, meaningless fiction (Santa) and a true philosophical and spiritual discipline (religions like my own: Christianity). it's best to just be honest the entire time and not go "THIS invisible guy is fake, but THIS invisible guy is real", especially in a world where so many people think in elementary-level "absolutes" instead of taking the time to really evaluate situations before making decisions.


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#3 Dec 30, 2019 3:45 AM

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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

I was raised in believing in the jolly old elf.

But I think saying he’s not real is fine. Eventually your kids will find out he’s not real and well. They’ll move on knowing family gets them these things.


I think there’s no wrong or right answer but being truthful and letting know from a young age and being truthful is a right way to go.


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#4 Jan 01, 2020 4:01 PM

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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

I mean i believe Abrahamic religions were made out of spite, not truth. If You look at The history and values of it. And what if promoting some of those values does The opposite.

I made a new religious cult. God of Obvious Good and Evil. The real truth

But to sum up, reason society goes bad is religion in government, marxism or fascism. What they need to hold onto power is scapegoating. And thats what makes a society go bad. Democracy AS institution probably is best so far, aswell AS it has bonus stuff like human rights focus.

But when it comes to fictional joy like Santa...if You are encouraged to do good things. Then i dont see it AS bad thing.

But AS a whole... never really bought into Santa, i dont think it was overly glorified. It just seems like some tradition like christmas is in a sense where The main focus is to show appreciation and good will to other people. But aslong AS humans Learn how to be Kind to one another « Death stranding video game for example» then i think its good. To learn how to appreciate others and learn The meaning in it. Be Nice and do your best.

Last edited by Steinar34 (Jan 01, 2020 4:29 PM)


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#5 Jan 01, 2020 4:41 PM

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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

Cool how do I join your cult?


In the absence of a conscious entity, the moon remains a radically ambiguous and ceaselessly flowing quantum soup.

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#6 Jan 01, 2020 4:59 PM

Steinar34
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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

Twingo wrote:

Cool how do I join your cult?

Easy. The idea is to encourage obvious good stuff.. and not do obvious bad stuff. Basically for good to exist, evil have to exist too. Even though one isnt to act on evil though.


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#7 Jan 01, 2020 5:26 PM

36IStillLikeSpyro36
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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

Steinar34 has been banned (ban evasion).

for the record, if (non-Steinar) users want to say things like this:

Steinar34 wrote:

I mean i believe Abrahamic religions were made out of spite, not truth. If You look at The history and values of it. And what if promoting some of those values does The opposite.

i disagree with this sentiment but i can't stop you from saying it, but we have a "Serious Discussion" sub-forum for a reason. please take outright religious discussions there, thanks smile


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#8 Jan 01, 2020 10:05 PM

Stormy
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Re: Did you believe in Santa? Should kids be told about Santa?

36IStillLikeSpyro36 wrote:

my mom raised me on Santa Claus and it... honestly bothered me a lot that my family had lied to me that whole time. and for no good reason. if i were in charge of kids for some reason, i would not raise them on Santa.

the idea that there's "magic" to Christmas is (or at least should be) a very troubling sign of the depths that consumerism has lowered our culture to. look at the world through the eyes of a philosopher/poet/artist -- the world is already full of wonder and amazement. it's just that that wonder and amazement is deemed "archaic" or "mundane" by our (ironically very archaic and mundane) culture. fiction can easily be "magical" without trying to blur the line between it, and reality. (look at the popularity of Lord of the Rings for example!) and the idea that people get offended when a literal lie is called a literal lie just shows how close-minded and ridiculous society has gotten. and what's really sad is how complacent people have been in letting it reach this point. but anyway.




and in a "religious" / theological sense, i fear that a child's mind could easily get confused between simple, meaningless fiction (Santa) and a true philosophical and spiritual discipline (religions like my own: Christianity). it's best to just be honest the entire time and not go "THIS invisible guy is fake, but THIS invisible guy is real", especially in a world where so many people think in elementary-level "absolutes" instead of taking the time to really evaluate situations before making decisions.

All of this. Completely agree.

Apparently my parents decided not to tell us the Santa story because my dad had the same response you did when he found out it wasn't real. A lot of people say stuff like "oh, no one gets upset about it, it's just fun, you're being too sensitive!" But now I have at least two counterexamples. tongue

The theological confusion aspect was another factor for sure. Telling kids that there's someone watching them all year who gives rewards for being good and punishments for being bad is a just a really dumbed-down version of heaven vs hell. Which, if you believe in that, why would you want to confuse your kid that way? It would be really easy for them to jump to the conclusion that if one is fake, the other must be, too.

Another thing I didn't really mention in my original post: gratitude. If kids think they're getting their presents as a reward for being good, they'll think they deserved them or are entitled to them, and they probably won't even think about thanking the gift-giver. Which is not how gifts are supposed to work at all. It's not a gift anymore if there are conditions attached.


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