what will happen to spyro ater dawn of the dragon ?

RedDragonX · Nov 12, 2008 10:04 PM

Exactly the point Trasher258, they needed to be more innovative to help push an interest for Spyro to more gamers...if they truly wanted to make a dent in the pride of the series...

ratchet · Nov 13, 2008 10:23 AM

There are only few games that people line up for these days. And you might say that People only lined up For Super Mario galaxy due to it being "a popular franchise". nethertheless, we see that people still love platformers. People loved games like R&C:TOD and Jak and Daxter and people still buy sonic games and Banjo kazooie and stuff.
Platformers not in= Epic Fail
It is true that the most polular type of genre that game designers make is FPS these days, but that does not meanm that Spyro has to be a shooter to go well in the market. If anything, variety and not going with the crowd could win for Spyro, and people are getting sick of FPS.
I'm sure there are alot of people begging for good 3D platformers these days, and when i say I'M SURE, i mean I'M SURE!
Heres just a few things they can incorperate if they go back to the originals
A.Maybe make a darker, more epic plot, atleast more in-depth.
B.Stick to the main Spyro feel.
C.Get stewart Copeland back (if they can).
D.longer game time
E.Better graphics
F.Difficulty select
G.More levels
H.Replay value of some kind
I.Time trial modes
J.Splitscreen Co-op/minigames inside levels (online would be pure awesomeness)
K.Any kind of multiplayer (again, online= pwnage)
L.Records in minigames
M.Ditch the breaths, make better special abilities

And I bet there's a whole lot more stuff.
There are people who say that the originals could not be improved, i just proved them wrong.
And yeah, i want no comments saying "that's good, but they wont go back....." because the whole meaning of this post was to say that they could, and make good improvements while doing that.

RedDragonX · Nov 13, 2008 6:58 PM

Well you are just so sure of yourself Ratchet. Why don't you try sending a letter over to Sierra and talk them back into the older series.

It is not going to happen! I wouldn't mind if it did...but it's not. The entire point of creating the series was to create a NEW Spyro universe to base future projects from. They have just finished creating a rather popular trilogy..and now they are making a movie about it...

Not so much of a failure if you ask me...the most negative thing of all about it is that it has managed to effectively divide the fanbase. They will continue to base games off this formula as long as it remains popular and keeps the money rolling in.

As much as some people would love to resurrect the old series...what good would it do them besides just confusing everybody. A project like that would require one VERY big commitment. I would love to see them try...but the decks stack in favor of the Legend Series...and that's the way they will continue to go.

Your points are correct...if they ever did go back to the old series they could very well make those changes....but the odds of it happening are so dismal their is almost no point to talking about it.

Trasher258 · Nov 13, 2008 8:55 PM

XRedDragonX wrote:

Your points are correct...if they ever did go back to the old series they could very well make those changes....but the odds of it happening are so dismal their is almost no point to talking about it.

I can say that odds don't prevent some things from happening whether you like it or not. Are you that stubborn? o_O I don't wish to argue but I'm not changing my mind about what I think and nothing is going to change that.

I'm sure there is a way...there is always a way. I'm content on finding it. big_smile

RedDragonX · Nov 13, 2008 9:00 PM

If you truly wish to try it then go for it. I am not down on the fact that they might be able to bring the old games back. Power too you if you do...but realistically the way things are heading the chances are very low.

I have nothing against the old series..I do miss them in some ways...but I am not disappointed with what they have done. You can think whatever you want to think...that's one of the great things about being human...nobody is going to change minds....so you can do whatever you want....but don't say the same thing about fans of LOS...because that hardly seems fair.

Stubborn? No...I am simply a realist...and I take things how they are presented.....that's just the way I am.

Kazoobie64 · Nov 13, 2008 9:04 PM

Realism is "anything can happen." Games can be tanked unexpectedly, or handed off to someone else as DotD itself seems to prove.

RedDragonX · Nov 13, 2008 10:39 PM

Very true. Like I said I take life as it comes...any situation. If they suddently dump LOS to pave way for the old games again then ok....becuase yes you are right anything can happen...but I will take the situation for what it is at the time...I wont just live off past events.

ratchet · Nov 14, 2008 6:47 AM

Ok......
Firstly i wrote:

And yeah, i want no comments saying "that's good, but they wont go back....." because the whole meaning of this post was to say that they could, and make good improvements while doing that.

Then Reddragon wrote:

It is not going to happen! I wouldn't mind if it did...but it's not.

hmmmmmm........

Jackson117 · Nov 14, 2008 9:40 AM

Anything can happen oh dear Next star wars spyro games?

RedDragonX · Nov 14, 2008 5:48 PM

Your allowed to argue points I have made....I understand if you don't like people questioning your views....but oh no...that's what happened. I said that it could very well happen..as out of place that it would be....but my nice realistic attitude takes the situation for what it is.

Torch Firetongue · Nov 14, 2008 9:20 PM

ratchet wrote:

There are only few games that people line up for these days. And you might say that People only lined up For Super Mario galaxy due to it being "a popular franchise". nethertheless, we see that people still love platformers. People loved games like R&C:TOD and Jak and Daxter and people still buy sonic games and Banjo kazooie and stuff.
Platformers not in= Epic Fail
It is true that the most polular type of genre that game designers make is FPS these days, but that does not meanm that Spyro has to be a shooter to go well in the market. If anything, variety and not going with the crowd could win for Spyro, and people are getting sick of FPS.
I'm sure there are alot of people begging for good 3D platformers these days, and when i say I'M SURE, i mean I'M SURE!
Heres just a few things they can incorperate if they go back to the originals
A.Maybe make a darker, more epic plot, atleast more in-depth.
B.Stick to the main Spyro feel.
C.Get stewart Copeland back (if they can).
D.longer game time
E.Better graphics
F.Difficulty select
G.More levels
H.Replay value of some kind
I.Time trial modes
J.Splitscreen Co-op/minigames inside levels (online would be pure awesomeness)
K.Any kind of multiplayer (again, online= pwnage)
L.Records in minigames
M.Ditch the breaths, make better special abilities
And I bet there's a whole lot more stuff.
There are people who say that the originals could not be improved, i just proved them wrong.
And yeah, i want no comments saying "that's good, but they wont go back....." because the whole meaning of this post was to say that they could, and make good improvements while doing that.

One cannot be sure as whether or not the pre-LOS series of games are gone for sure, but the scenario seems likely. I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but it is rather unlikely that the game directors will return to the originals. However, it would be a very good idea if elements from those original games, or reintroduce some of its characters, and incorporate into the LOS series.

I'll go into each of ratchet's criticisms about the Spyro series.

Point A: The legend of Spyro series did contain, at least in my mind, a deeper, darker plot in comparison to the previous Spyro games, whose villains I found sadly comical and its storyline, rather shallow. In truth, you can't really go an darker with the plot unless you plan on raise the rating to T, which would be fine with me, but would potentially alienate the younger fans, which I doubt the game designers would even consider.

Point B: Can you describe to me what you consider the 'Main Spyro feel' to be? The feel of a game is inherently a very vague concept, but if you mean a return to the more comical Spyro games, I'm afraid I'll have to disagree with you there.

Point C: Of course, it would be nice if Copeland could return, but I feel the current music producers are good enough as they are. I do see the need that any future game in the LOS Universe needs a few more comical numbers to lighten the mood from time to time.

Point D: This is again a very vague notion, about a longer game length. To accomplish this you need variety, not merely length.

Point E: They shouldn't spend too much time dealing with graphics. The thing is, if the graphics are too complex, that limits the space in which the designers use for the actual gameplay, which I feel is more important. To me, the graphics are suitable for the series.

Point F: Yes, I agree with you there. A difficultly setting would be nice.

Point G: Everyone wants more levels, and being able to reply the levels would be doubly nice. A very good idea for me would be something similar to what Kingdom Hearts did when you traveled the worlds. First, you got introduced to that world, and while you progressed through the game, new events occurred in that particular world, and the same concept could be applied to any future Spyro games. That would produce longer game time without needing to designs more levels, and gives a reason to return to previous levels.

Point H: I'm not sure that you really need a time trial mode, expect if there are some free-flying levels.

Point I: Split screen Co-op would be awesome, especially if combined with a Kingdom Hearts style battle system.

Point J: I'm afraid that multiplayer possibilities would be limited to arena matches, unless you design a Spyro game ala World of Warcraft, but then that would require users to pay a monthy fee to play, which most of the SPyro fans (who are teenage) would not be able to pay. Tell me ratchet, do you have a credit card?

Point K: Minigames are always nice, the Spyro games could always use some as a diversion.

Point L: Abandon the breaths? What are you kidding? Can you imagine a dragon that doesn't use a breath weapon? What I think the designers can do is add other abilities in addition to the breaths; again using a Kingdom HEarts style menu system would make organizing and the use of them more convenient.

One of my own points: Any future Spryo game should use an RPG-style menu, which details status, armor, abilities, items (though where a dragon would store them seeing they don't have any pockets), and make managing Spyro, Cynder, or any other character who might join them, much easier.

RedDragonX · Nov 14, 2008 9:37 PM

Wow someone on my side in this debate for once lol...nice job on picking out each of those points. The developers will not go back to the games...it has been verified and they have no reason too. The only true reason I could think of was the fact that it has driven away some of the older fans...

But...as said before..they knew that they would be losing fans from this reboot. The storyline, as cliched as it was at points, was much darker to the just as cliched storyline in the original Spyro games....the main Spyro feel that he talks about is the wonderful feeling that the players got in the open world from the previous games...something which he of course thinks has been trashed in this series...just a disgruntled fan who really really wants them to involve the old series in any way they can.

I def agree with you on the music...I loved Copeland's style in the originals...but the music composers did just as good a job with the environments and events this time around as well..I actully thought it was one of the highpoints.

I do have to agree with the game length...I think they should have made a larger world to explore...and involved things like...more pieces of armor to find...or more challenges to face in each world....not horribly longer...but at a good 20 hours much like KH would take.

Good call on the difficulty setting...that was something they sorely needed. They did attempt to incorporate the replay levels in this last instalment..which was a very good addition...so why worry about that one.

Time trials and such were a way to find something extra in a level or an extra challenge...which they could have included if they wanted too..but these are new developers with a new feel...and they don't think it's necessary to the overall quality. The whole splitscreen thing I could see happening....and they took the right steps in this latest game to at least incorporate a second player option.

An online addition would be nice if it was a large universe like game..much like WoW...if you could create your own dragon and go..that would be awesome to the extreme...much like he mentioned before....unless it was free or one extremely highly developed game it wont happen.

Minigames are a good option...it worked in KH...without horribly distracting everyone....as for the breath thing...um.....why would you ever consider getting rid of them.

It is up to the developers to learn what the fans want and what they should put into the next game to make it enjoyable for all. But since they want to continue with the LoS universe..that story isn't going to end...and I don't see them wishing to connect with the old games since they sacrificed so much just to reboot it.

Kazoobie64 · Nov 14, 2008 9:44 PM

Man, that's a lot of words. Do I really have to dispute them all?

Trasher258 · Nov 14, 2008 9:45 PM

Torch Firetongue wrote:

...Point B: Can you describe to me what you consider the 'Main Spyro feel' to be? The feel of a game is inherently a very vague concept, but if you mean a return to the more comical Spyro games, I'm afraid I'll have to disagree with you there.
Point C: Of course, it would be nice if Copeland could return, but I feel the current music producers are good enough as they are. I do see the need that any future game in the LOS Universe needs a few more comical numbers to lighten the mood from time to time. ...

Point B: I think he means the more less epic climatic feel but I'm not exactly sure. Ratchet might be able to explain it better than I can.

Point C: The LOS feel is abit over the top most of the time but I did find the intro theme from ANB to be very touching. I agree that there can be a use of a more old-fashion style music but I want to steer away from using electronic interments. I think I can come up with some music with a violin, harp, bongos, clarinet and of course a acoustic guitar. Who says you can't have some well crafted music with those? I had some song using those interments going on in my head last night. If I only had a Producer version of Fruity Loops 8...

RedDragonX · Nov 14, 2008 9:51 PM

Kazoobie64 wrote:

Man, that's a lot of words. Do I really have to dispute them all?

No lol...that way we can live in peace for awhile....just let the developers do their thing.

And I'm sure that Ratchet is gonna explain it as best he can....it's kinda hard to steer away from any music involving electronic instruments...but I like the music fine in both series...one thing I have never been able to complain about..

Kazoobie64 · Nov 14, 2008 9:54 PM

XRedDragonX wrote:

just let the developers do their thing.

Sorry, no can do, these developers suck.

RedDragonX · Nov 14, 2008 10:00 PM

Kazoobie64 wrote:

XRedDragonX wrote:
just let the developers do their thing.
Sorry, no can do, these developers suck.

Well unfortunetly we are not in charge of hiring or firing them lol....otherwise I'm sure we would have done something about it. Let's see if they find someone who actually cares.

Kazoobie64 · Nov 14, 2008 10:22 PM

Firing is a little harsh... I'm sure they have to feed their families and I'm sure there are some innocents working there that would like the game to be better but they are of course, working for someone else.

RedDragonX · Nov 14, 2008 10:34 PM

Well of course. I'm sure that they didn't want to totally trash Spyro...it's never the drive of any of them to do that...just the level of quality they put into it to make it respectable is the factor.

Firing no...but we have yet to find a developer who truly cares to make this something more then what it has been....or perhaps they simply have not tried hard enough yet.

Stormy · Nov 14, 2008 11:32 PM

Yeah, they can make other games, just don't mess up the Spyro I knew and loved. ;-;

Torch Firetongue · Nov 15, 2008 12:34 AM

Stormy wrote:

Yeah, they can make other games, just don't mess up the Spyro I knew and loved. ;-;

To tell you the truth, it was actually the whole reboot of the Spyro series that got me interested in the series again. I really loved the first few games made by Insomniac, but the ones in the middle and the gameboy ones were rather bland.

It added more depth to the series as a whole, even though the story itself was somewhat cliched, which is unsurprising considering the audience that it was aiming for. What I also really appreciated about the Legend of Spyro series was that they hired top-notch actors to voice the characters, and that you really felt a connection with the characters and empathize with them, like Ignitus, Cynder, Sparx and even Molier. That was more than enough to counterbalance the series' rather linear and dull gameplay.

The characters in the previous series didn't have that depth for me or that level of empathy. To me, they were just NPC's that told you what quest you had to accomplish.

TornWings · Nov 15, 2008 2:35 AM

...hmm. Am I the only one who enjoyed the gameplay from TLOS? It's starting to look that way.

err, back to this discussion... I think the music from the TLOS series is excellent, though I can't compare it to that of the originals as I haven't heard it.

...I wish I had more to say right now, this discussion is getting interesting.

Stormy · Nov 15, 2008 3:01 AM

Torch Firetongue wrote:

Stormy wrote:
Yeah, they can make other games, just don't mess up the Spyro I knew and loved. ;-;
To tell you the truth, it was actually the whole reboot of the Spyro series that got me interested in the series again. I really loved the first few games made by Insomniac, but the ones in the middle and the gameboy ones were rather bland.

I agree with you: the games after the Insomniac ones were crap, but in my opinion, TLoS wasn't much of an improvement. I think what they should have done was erased ETD-SL rather than everything.

I also didn't mind that the original games didn't have "in depth characters" or a complicated story because I was too interested in actually playing the games, not wondering when the next cutscene in this stupid linear level was going to be. The whole situation with Bianca and Hunter in YoTD did add some extra interest, but I would have liked the game either way.

Trasher258 · Nov 15, 2008 3:18 AM

There is also the details in the old series in the environment that may have a background or history to them but it's not mentioned. For example, StD had many portal arch like structures in some levels and flags in others. The Artisan Home is detailed as a island when your on the dock where the balloonist is. I wonder what is beyond that waterfall, behind the Sunny Flight portal when it's inactive...alot of stuff like that. LoS series has similar things going on but it's difficult to find something of interest with all the events happening around you. Then again, I don't really play any of the LoS games much. They don't grab my attention like the original did. Even when I beaten StD a couple of times I still end up noticing some curiously looking objects in the environment.

Exploration, discovery, learning loads of new things... that's what drives most people right? Put some weird and interesting things that somebody might crave and you got something to work with.

RedDragonX · Nov 15, 2008 3:21 AM

Stormy wrote:

Torch Firetongue wrote:
Stormy wrote:
Yeah, they can make other games, just don't mess up the Spyro I knew and loved. ;-;
To tell you the truth, it was actually the whole reboot of the Spyro series that got me interested in the series again. I really loved the first few games made by Insomniac, but the ones in the middle and the gameboy ones were rather bland.
I agree with you: the games after the Insomniac ones were crap, but in my opinion, TLoS wasn't much of an improvement. I think what they should have done was erased ETD-SL rather than everything.
I also didn't mind that the original games didn't have "in depth characters" or a complicated story because I was too interested in actually playing the games, not wondering when the next cutscene in this stupid linear level was going to be. The whole situation with Bianca and Hunter in YoTD did add some extra interest, but I would have liked the game either way.

I agree with both of you pretty much.....the games that followed Insomniac really killed my interest in the series....so I really needed something different to renew my interest....I didn't think the gameplay was all that bad....but it was kinda...kluncky...I guess...I don't know the real word to explain it.

I mean look at the gameplay in the original series....flame attack...headbutt...jump....glide....it wasn't anything the new games included.....but the worlds were much more involving with the charcter..thus as Stormy said...made the levels enjoyable to play even without a storyline to back it up.

That and the whole market it was introduced too was absolutly blown away by the game....since it was innovative and something new...and today obviously...it's not. The reboot got me really into the games again...and I will always love the old ones no matter what.

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