what will happen to spyro ater dawn of the dragon ?

Randompeep15 · Dec 30, 2008 12:15 PM

ratchet wrote:

I've given you more than enough evidence that Insomniac's change had nothing to do with the market, it was due to Spyro's limitations, they didn't think they could develop him anymore so they moved on, THAT'S IT. Many gaming companies move on for more reasons than market, yes some do move just because of market, but it was not the case with Insomniac Games.
Insomiac only created three Spyro games...and after the third game was released..they realized their limitations with the character and just how much they could do with him...so they switched over to Ratchet and Clank...for which they have released Six titles as opposed to Spyro's three...so they have made much more fortune with the change from Spyro to R+C...so the sales in general favor the new change.
Reguardless, That doesn't prove anything. It's obvious Insomniac Can Continue creating Ratchet and Clank games because he has more capabilities thanm Spyro, the reason they left Spyro in the first place. And I've already stated how good the sales were for Spyro, and actually increased between 200, 000 dollars between Spyro 2 And Spyro 3, so Money was defiently not the reason they left Spyro.

Hand on a sec, can't you see Sierra did SO MUCH MORE with spyro like melees, and Insomniac didn't even do different breath! Not saying Insomniac are bad or anything but i hope you understnad what i'm trying to say.

Spyro Master · Dec 30, 2008 6:31 PM

can we plz go bak on topic if uw ant to argue about sierra vs isomniac go and make a section on it yeh i know wot both companies have done bt thats in the past so let it drop plz and get bak to the topic in hand anyway thx reddragon and yeh i suppose they should stray away from malefor 4 a while bt out of randomness wot about that owl that got away in TEN? lol

ratchet · Dec 31, 2008 5:02 AM

Randompeep15 wrote:

ratchet wrote:
I've given you more than enough evidence that Insomniac's change had nothing to do with the market, it was due to Spyro's limitations, they didn't think they could develop him anymore so they moved on, THAT'S IT. Many gaming companies move on for more reasons than market, yes some do move just because of market, but it was not the case with Insomniac Games.
Insomiac only created three Spyro games...and after the third game was released..they realized their limitations with the character and just how much they could do with him...so they switched over to Ratchet and Clank...for which they have released Six titles as opposed to Spyro's three...so they have made much more fortune with the change from Spyro to R+C...so the sales in general favor the new change.
Reguardless, That doesn't prove anything. It's obvious Insomniac Can Continue creating Ratchet and Clank games because he has more capabilities thanm Spyro, the reason they left Spyro in the first place. And I've already stated how good the sales were for Spyro, and actually increased between 200, 000 dollars between Spyro 2 And Spyro 3, so Money was defiently not the reason they left Spyro.

Hand on a sec, can't you see Sierra did SO MUCH MORE with spyro like melees, and Insomniac didn't even do different breath! Not saying Insomniac are bad or anything but i hope you understnad what i'm trying to say.

Yes, But that Was Sierra. Insomniac obviously did not think of those things. Besides, They wanted to stick to platforming when It came to Spyro, they didn't want to change Genres.

Stormy · Jan 01, 2009 12:45 AM

Why are "melees" and "different breaths" good? I personally am glad Insomniac did not include them. tongue More moves does not necessarily mean the game will be better.

RedDragonX · Jan 01, 2009 2:33 AM

Very true about the attacks....for some reason I get unsubscribed to this topic...but anyways I didn't say that the market in general was refusing the Spyro games...they could have went with them for even longer if they wanted to do so, but Insomniac wanted to take things in a different direction that would act and perform more to their original hopes, and that's what they did when they made the switch.

Again we are not the developers and we will not know what their true motives were for making such changes. Some can base it off sales and others will base it simply because they didn't want to keep running with Spyro and try something new, but all I can offer is my own experiences that I have had in the market environment...and to me their is no real move without some motive to gain advantage over the market again somehow.

I don't know for certain how the Spyro games would have turned out should Insomniac kept going with them...but for their own reasons...they decided to make a change...and no change is without proper reason. Could it have been that they simply became with Spyro's limitations?..Yes it certainly could have been...I'm not ruling out that possibility..I just try to apply what I have seen done many times before in the real world...and that is money is the driving factor in every single move companies make.

But yeah this argument really shouldn't be in this topic...we are just wonderful at really straying into the endless debate that has been created by both of the series.....but the future shouldn't involve Malefor...they should work on creating a more effective combination of both series through gameplay and story..if the two elements were combined at effective levels then the game would really sit well with just about all fans.

ratchet · Jan 01, 2009 8:32 AM

XRedDragonX wrote:

Very true about the attacks....for some reason I get unsubscribed to this topic...but anyways I didn't say that the market in general was refusing the Spyro games...they could have went with them for even longer if they wanted to do so, but Insomniac wanted to take things in a different direction that would act and perform more to their original hopes, and that's what they did when they made the switch.

I agree, Still nothing to do with the Market...

Again we are not the developers and we will not know what their true motives were for making such changes. Some can base it off sales and others will base it simply because they didn't want to keep running with Spyro and try something new, but all I can offer is my own experiences that I have had in the market environment...and to me their is no real move without some motive to gain advantage over the market again somehow.

seeing I've given you more than enough evidence saying that It is not the market, while you have given none, It is obvious that They changed for no reason reguarding the market.

I don't know for certain how the Spyro games would have turned out should Insomniac kept going with them...but for their own reasons...they decided to make a change...and no change is without proper reason.

And I have given you "proper reason"

Could it have been that they simply became with Spyro's limitations?..Yes it certainly could have been...I'm not ruling out that possibility..I just try to apply what I have seen done many times before in the real world...and that is money is the driving factor in every single move companies make.

Ah, yes, I agree, I am saying that Due to Spyro's limitations, Next Spyro games would have been not as innovative and fun, as Insomniac were running out of Ideas, and would lose money.

But yeah this argument really shouldn't be in this topic...we are just wonderful at really straying into the endless debate that has been created by both of the series.....

Yes, But there's no reason to start a new topic.

Stormy · Jan 01, 2009 2:21 PM

As far as I'm concerned, this is on topic. We're talking about whether Spyro should change or not, aren't we?

I don't know for certain how the Spyro games would have turned out should Insomniac kept going with them...but for their own reasons...they decided to make a change...and no change is without proper reason.

Does the fact that the originals still have much better reviews than the new ones count as "proper reason"? I would think so; the old games were much more widely liked than TLoS. TLoS only appeals to people who like the beat-em-up type games (or cheesy, cliche storylines), but the originals appealed to a lot of different people. Heck, my dad even liked Spyro for a while.

RedDragonX · Jan 01, 2009 5:48 PM

Yes the Spyro games were more popular back then as opposed to today's world...and again you guys just refuse to see this but Spyro was introduced as a fresh new idea to the gaming industry when it first came out and was praised for it's overall quality and style. That was the pride that Insomniac put into the series and it really paid off for them...today is a completely different world and people see things in a different light. Yes they are using a different style in LoS...and they knew that it wasn't going to appeal to every single Spyro fan...I don't even like it as much as the originals and never will.

As for the "proper reason"..although the game was receiving good reviews and generating a very positive income...after YotD they saw just what the limitations were with Spyro and just how he could adapt into their future ideas...and he couldn't.

As for Ratchet's first comment. Yes that totally has to do with the market...they wanted to make a switch that would help accomidate their new idea to the way things were moving in the gaming industry...and that in turn made them switch to a different direction...that is pure marketplace motivation right there.

And you have not given me any evidence that really supports your theory...the games were doing well yes...but a company does not make a move to just make a move because they were bored with the games. They made the move because they believed it would be more productive for them...and that is again Marketplace motivation...anything involving money that comes with drastic change is that motivation. Again if you don't want to see that fine...I simply point out what everyone does.

You have not given me a "proper reason"...Insomniac gave their so called reason for the change....that the Spyro character had "limitations." Which in turn means that they couldn't continue to build upon the character without running into brick walls...and in turn that would cause the series damage over time...so they made a change to introduce something that they could evolve over time...and their is your marketplace change.

And as for that comment you pretty much just prove my point right there. They would lose money and run out of ideas due to limitations...so they made the change so that they could generate more ideas and money with a new franchise.

But yeah I suppose this does still pertain to the topic...I'm sure people are just sick of watching us constantly debate this subject.

Spyro Master · Jan 01, 2009 8:55 PM

yes!!! finally no more debating about it right now wot r otehr peoples idea bout wot will happen after DOTD

RedDragonX · Jan 01, 2009 9:49 PM

Well I don't know if that will stop the debate lol...but I think I already shared my idea of what might happen.

zxsuomi · Jan 02, 2009 9:57 AM

Realy don't know what happen...
TLOS is happend before spyro 1.
Spyro is younger again and there is hunter too,but no cynder so wtf hapend(if cynder is dead,i eat all here...)

Hope they make game after ripto's quest and spyro meet cynder again and remember all what happend him first life (lol?)

Then there is old chars,cynder,spyro and sparx and story contiue.
Malefor is trapped in crystal,him is not dead so what can hapen...

I think they need made one game after TLOS,but before spyro 1 so we know what hapend for cynder,sparx and spyro.

Bad english,so good if you know what i try mean--->

ratchet · Jan 02, 2009 12:17 PM

XRedDragonX wrote:

As for Ratchet's first comment. Yes that totally has to do with the market...they wanted to make a switch that would help accomidate their new idea to the way things were moving in the gaming industry...and that in turn made them switch to a different direction...that is pure marketplace motivation right there.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no , NO! AGAIN, I wasn't saying they needed to change because the market was changing, I said they were changing because They couldn't do anything else with him, and they knew that games that were just like the last ones would lose money, and so THATS why they didn't continue.

And you have not given me any evidence that really supports your theory...the games were doing well yes...but a company does not make a move to just make a move because they were bored with the games. They made the move because they believed it would be more productive for them...and that is again Marketplace motivation...anything involving money that comes with drastic change is that motivation. Again if you don't want to see that fine...I simply point out what everyone does.

Everyone points out that they changed due to limitations. And I don't disagree with you about money, I think they DID change for money, as I just explained, but not because they thought A Platformer-shooter would do better in the market than an action-platformer with the exact same mood, but because They thought they could do more things with a more advanced character and setting.

You have not given me a "proper reason"...Insomniac gave their so called reason for the change....that the Spyro character had "limitations." Which in turn means that they couldn't continue to build upon the character without running into brick walls...and in turn that would cause the series damage over time...so they made a change to introduce something that they could evolve over time...and their is your marketplace change.

No again, I am NOT saying the character needed more limitations to adjust for different Genres, I am saying that the character needed more limitations in general, and for other reasons, such as changing to a different setting.

And as for that comment you pretty much just prove my point right there. They would lose money and run out of ideas due to limitations...so they made the change so that they could generate more ideas and money with a new franchise.

Ah yes, exaculy. But you're saying they changed for the MARKET, which means more appealing to the people of that age, which is false.

But yeah I suppose this does still pertain to the topic...I'm sure people are just sick of watching us constantly debate this subject.

Owell, plenty more topic in the sea....

Spyro Master · Jan 02, 2009 1:22 PM

has any1 noticed though if TLOS is b4 the first spyro then is teh hunter of avalar an ansestor of hunter from spyro 2

Stormy · Jan 02, 2009 3:06 PM

TLoS is not before Spyro 1. It's a reboot, plain and simple.

jellyspyro · Jan 02, 2009 9:09 PM

hmm hunter is pretty weird... no when i first saw him i waas like O...m...G!!! now im just ok with it. im used to it tongue

RedDragonX · Jan 02, 2009 10:36 PM

I know that's what you were saying....and that just proves my point more. You say that they changed because the character had limitations...and in turn that is very correct...his limitations led to them moving out of that general area of gaming and into another so they could continue to build upon the franchise for the future (R+C).

Yes you are correct. THey changed because the Spyro character had limitations that they could not continue to build upon in the market...so they switched as to avoid further money loss in future games...and that in turn is tied into the paranoia that the series of Spyro plateforming games would have failed them in the future...thus leading to the change as to avoid eventual financial disastor.

Could they have kept going with success?.....I don't know...maybe...but we will never know now. They made the change and that's where it has lead them today. All we can do now is wonder.

I don't know what exactly you are pointing out about more limitations to the character...might want to reword that in your next response. As far as I can see too many limitations caused them to shift directions as to further enhance their future endeavors.

As for the changing in the market that's what this is. They changed directions due to their limitations with Spyro..which in turn would have hurt their future marketplace chances and total income based off the franchise. It may not have effected the market right away...but they were thinking long term...so they shifted so that they could work the way gaming was going in general. The plateformers are not nearly as popular today as they were 10 years ago...that's the change they adapted to earlier sooner then later.

And LoS was originally introduced as a prequel to the original series...but after awhile they started going with the notion that it was an entirly different series...not a very wise move...but that's what they decided to do.

Cynder's Friend · Jan 02, 2009 10:57 PM

yea cuz i remember hear iggy say something about YOTD in ANB
thats one of tha ways they connect the original series to the legend series

I believe that since iggy is the new chronicler that his determinosity to find spyro and cynder
will prevail in continuing the LOS series which will have aniother good LOS game

I really hope so

(pleeeeeezzeee)

Stormy · Jan 02, 2009 11:04 PM

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say about the limitations. It seems to me you're just parroting Insomniac's reason for quitting without giving any details on what the supposed limitations actually are. Do you mean original-style Spyro would get boring after a while because there aren't enough "cool moves"? Plenty of games have had very basic moves for years and are still good; Mario for example yet again. I don't think the "limitations" as far as moves go would be a big problem; all they'd need to do would be to create new levels for each game and occasionally some new characters, minigames, and simple-ish moves to keep it fresh.

RedDragonX · Jan 02, 2009 11:35 PM

Well I don't know if you are asking either me or Ratchet...but Insomniac wanted to have something they could build upon with the Spyro character...with such as having him use weapons and do more human related stuff perhaps....it was stuff that they wanted to include in their games as to make them more productive and enjoyable for fans...

When it came to Spyro...they wanted to build even more upon the character from YotD...but for their said reasons that the character had its limits...thye decided to switch gears over to the Ratchet and Clank series.

I don't know why they did it or their exact reasons except for Spyro's "limitations" but if that was their primary reason then we can't really change how they thought about it. Some felt it could still be built upon and some didn't...but they obviously wanted a change...so that's what they did.

Stormy · Jan 03, 2009 12:29 AM

So you don't know what the limitations are, but you're using it as a reason that it was a good idea for Spyro to change? Sorry, but that makes no sense.

RedDragonX · Jan 03, 2009 3:26 AM

We will never know what his limitations were. As far as I'm concerned they could have continued the games if they wanted to...don't make this about me because I'm merely stating that Insomniac realized that Spyro had limitations...and they obviously changed it because of those limitations...we are not the developers and we don't make those decisions.

And both I and Ratchet agree on the fact the character had limitations...but don't throw it back against me simply because I mentioned it....and as for making sense...apparently it made sense to them otherwise they would not have changed directions.

ratchet · Jan 03, 2009 7:44 AM

Ah, I'm sick of Debating here....

Spyro Master · Jan 03, 2009 11:20 AM

finally no debating! and stormy i gt mixed up form otehr things on here about TLOS being b4 the original oh well no-ones perfect lol smile

Aceedwin · Jan 03, 2009 1:57 PM

Mull: I'm gonna put the whole arguement into metaphorical terms for fun!

Imagine Spyro's game potential as a piece of bread. Although it was brilliant tasting bread, the bakers new that eventually it would go mouldy. So to stop this they toasted it. With me so far? They toasted it to stop it getting mouldy. Unfortunately the bread itself tasted better than the toast to most people and they threw down the toast saying "We want bread!".

But they didn't understand that if the bread had not been toasted, it would have gone mouldy, and that result is much worse than the toast. The bakers had prolonged the bread, but slightly diminished it's quality. So, in a way, the bakers had done the right thing.

The End

If you did not understand this story, congratualtions! You are sane! If you did understand this story, congratulations! You are open minded.

If my judgement is terrible and you weren't talking about old vs. new spyro at all. Ignore this post big_smile

Stormy · Jan 03, 2009 4:28 PM

ratchet wrote:

Ah, I'm sick of Debating here....

You're not alone. But at the same time, I feel like I have to continue. -___-

I just don't think "limitations" should be used as a reason without actual knowledge of what the limitations are. It's like repeating an argument you only half understand, which of course seems pretty silly. As for me not using this argument because ratchet recognizes the limitations, well, I disagree with ratchet then. Being on the same general side doesn't mean we have to agree about everything.

Like I said, I understand what you're trying to say, Aceedwin, but I just can't agree. I mean, yeah, if they would have just kept cranking out the same thing over and over, yeah, it would get old, but as long as they can add some new things once in a while, it'll stay fresh. There wasn't any need to change it completely. Aren't there still platform games kind of like original Spyro that are doing well in today's market, maybe even better than TLoS? If there aren't, then OK, maybe I'm wrong, but I can't think of a single "limitation" that would cause them to have to stop making games like that completely.

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