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#1 Jan 31, 2016 6:45 PM

ManicX
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Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

FLAMING VS CHARGING

What is more valuable to Spyro? The ability to flame, or the ability to charge?
tumblr_inline_nqa3ssJ6bM1rbem7u_500.gif   
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OsPpUIQ.gif

Well a few months back I completed a ridiculously pointless challenge: geting as much % in Spyro as possible using only flame for one run, and only charge for another run. I just wanted an excuse to play Spyro again; but in a more challenging way than just the typical playthrough of getting 100% or even speedrunning! This challenge was inspired by RJWaters2's No Gliding Challenge.

The recording for this LP is completed, but not all of the episodes are uploaded yet, with a new one released every 10-14 days when possible.
So if you're interested in this, place your bets on which ability you think Spyro needs more below! You can find the videos in this playlist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_C72UPx … 5I&index=1.

Rules and Stipulations

If you want to know the rules and conditions set out for this challenge before viewing it rather than finding out potential issues I faced as the challenges progressed, then read below:

Hidden text

No Charge
1. Charging is forbidden. Should I charge accidentally the challenge remains intact as long as I do not benefit from the action [i.e] as long as it does not enable me to collect collectibles that would otherwise be inaccessible.
2. Supercharging is forbidden.
3. The charge function is allowed for Spyro's head jerk [often seen when attempting a proxy]. I am not allowed to abuse this to break open chests or defeat enemies... merely to gain a little extra height should I wish to take shortcuts.

No Flame
1. Flaming is forbidden. Should I flame accidentally the challenge remains intact as long as I do not benefit from the action [i.e] as long as it does not enable me to collect collectibles that would otherwise be inaccessible.
2. Super Flame is forbidden.

Both Challenges
Despite my best efforts to prove myself wrong, beating Gnasty Gnorc is NOT possible [prove me wrong please] without using flame and charge (charge cannot damage Gnasty, and without charging I cannot catch him in time to flame him). Interestingly I was able to get both thieves without being able to charge. However I thought it would be quite anti-climatic to end the challenges without being able to beat Gnorc. So for JUST the Gnasty Gnorc fight... I may use Flame and Charge where necessary.

The winning challenge is the one that achieves the highest % of completion.

This Challenge Run takes place only in the first Spyro the Dragon game. I currently have plans to eventually trial this challenge for the rest of the trilogy, although, with Spyro gaining new abilities in the other games, it may be less challenging than it was in the first game.

Warning: I am not a Spyro Pro. Just someone with a lot of spare time.

Last edited by ManicX (Jan 31, 2016 10:22 PM)

Which do you think is more valuable to Spyro during the first game? (Highest % Completion)

Flaming 22%
Charging 67%
Draw 11%
Total votes: 9

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#2 Jan 31, 2016 9:55 PM

LXShadow
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

That's a pretty interesting idea. I'm placing bets on Charge because of all the chargable gem containers and probably also enemies (reckon there's more chargable than flamable) ones.

Good luck with the run! P.S, your YouTube link needs fixing smile

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#3 Jan 31, 2016 10:24 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Thanks for pointing that out! The link has been fixed.

Not the first time I have rushed with typing:

See: My abysmal spelling of "Flaming" in Episode 1


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#4 Jan 31, 2016 11:46 PM

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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Oh man, both of those sound like they'd be really frustrating! I'm trying to imagine how I would catch an egg thief without charging at all.... I'd give up after a few tries, haha. Interesting idea, though, looking forward to seeing how this turns out!


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#5 Feb 01, 2016 8:16 PM

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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Anything to do with the best Spyro series is great although flaming is my favourite method of attack for Spyro followed closely by charging though I like them both equally. I'd say charging to get chests, beat Egg Theif's collect stuff but looking forward to how this turns out.


Reaching your end destination can feel like climbing a mountain, but you can get there!

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#6 Feb 02, 2016 9:20 AM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Early days yet but it seems Charging is the fan favourite to win!

Hidden text

Once I go through all the levels, I go back through to check I have get everything possible, and I manage to pick up a few extra things.

So if you're shouting at the screen "you could get that," in a future episode I just might!"


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#7 Feb 03, 2016 10:26 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

EPISODE 11: THAT WIZARD IS PEAK

270?cb=20130915230017

The newest episode is live and both Challenges face the daunting prospect that is Wizard Peak.
Find out if the No Charge Challenge can find away to reach the latter part of the Magic Crafters without using Super Charge!

Watch it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD7GbuG … e=youtu.be

Last edited by ManicX (Feb 03, 2016 10:27 PM)


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#8 Mar 05, 2016 3:13 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

I should have probably noted this earlier - the last couple of episodes had to be set to private for reasons - the series will resume by the end of this month


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#9 Mar 05, 2016 6:56 PM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

What are the conditions on charging in Gnasty Gnorc?

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#10 Mar 10, 2016 5:52 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Morgan wrote:

What are the conditions on charging in Gnasty Gnorc?

Hidden text

I try and do as much of his level without flaming or charging as possible, but of course it's impossibe, so I have to give an exception when necessary


Also, episode 10 has just been reuploaded. I'll reupload episode 11 in a couple days, and then have a new episode ready for the day after.


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#11 Mar 10, 2016 6:42 PM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

ManicX wrote:
Morgan wrote:

What are the conditions on charging in Gnasty Gnorc?

Hidden text

I try and do as much of his level without flaming or charging as possible, but of course it's impossibe, so I have to give an exception when necessary


Also, episode 10 has just been reuploaded. I'll reupload episode 11 in a couple days, and then have a new episode ready for the day after.

So, does that just mean that you're not allowed to destroy any iron chests on the no charge challenge?

Last edited by Morgan (Mar 10, 2016 6:43 PM)

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#12 Mar 11, 2016 8:49 AM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

In gerneral I can't destroy Iron Chests, but I can get a couple of them from opportunities that sometimes arise. It's getting some of these Iron Chests without Charge that was part of the fun.


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#13 Mar 11, 2016 10:13 AM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

ManicX wrote:

In gerneral I can't destroy Iron Chests, but I can get a couple of them from opportunities that sometimes arise. It's getting some of these Iron Chests without Charge that was part of the fun.

I was only talking about Gnasty Gnorc's level.

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#14 Mar 11, 2016 10:48 AM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Charging Iron Crates is banned yes. It wouldn't be much of a fair run if I lifted that rule to collect more gems just because they are in the final boss level.


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#15 Mar 11, 2016 11:01 AM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

ManicX wrote:

Charging Iron Crates is banned yes. It wouldn't be much of a fair run if I lifted that rule to collect more gems just because they are in the final boss level.

So, basically, when you're chasing Gnasty Gnorc, you have to avoid the iron chests? OK, thanks. My run of the no charge challenge had to be put on hiatus for weeks because of this potential loophole.

By the way, I'm an expert glitcher, so I might end up doing better at this than you. I know about some crazy exploits for these challenges.

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#16 Mar 11, 2016 2:22 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

yes, you cannot get any iron chests illegally.

Likewise you cannot use charge to get the thieves. You may only use charge to catch up to Gnorc.

Glitches are accepted as long as there is no charging involved. Not that I use any glitches tbh, I do it all by the book.



NEW EPISODE

BLOWING IS HARD
latest?cb=20090430214209

The Lord of the Magic Crafters, BlowHard, must be confronted by both challenges, before our duo of Spyro travel to the Beast Makers World, which resembles a Dragon Toilet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b1Jowe … e=youtu.be

Last edited by ManicX (Mar 11, 2016 2:36 PM)


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#17 Mar 11, 2016 2:51 PM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

No Charge Challenge Results:

10063 10072 10094 10120 10161 10171 10178 10234 10239 10323 10367 10371 Gems

78 Dragons

11 12 Eggs

90 91 92% Completion

I also created a points system:

Gem = 1 Point

Dragon = 150 Points

Egg = 1000 Points

Final Score: 32763 32772 32794 32820 32861 32871 32878 32934 32939 33023 34067 34071 Points

Level Gem Counts:

Artisans - 100/100
Stone Hill - 168/200
Dark Hollow - 100/100
Town Square - 162/200
Toasty - 97/100
Sunny Flight - 300/300

Peace Keepers - 190/200
Dry Canyon - 380/400
Cliff Town - 313/400
Ice Cavern - 319/400
Doctor Shemp - 268/300
Night Flight - 300/300

Magic Crafters - 223/300
Alpine Ridge - 417 443/500
High Caves - 411 415/500
Wizard Peak - 334 343 387/500
Blowhard - 345/400
Crystal Flight - 300/300

Beast Makers - 271/300
Terrace Village - 311 318/400
Misty Bog - 423/500
Tree Tops - 351 407/500
Metalhead - 440/500
Wild Flight - 300/300

Dream Weavers - 238/300
Dark Passage - 438 460 470 475/500
Lofty Castle - 359 400/400
Haunted Towers - 252/500
Jacques - 448/500
Icy Flight - 300/300

Gnorc Gnexus - 185/200
Gnorc Cove - 319/400
Twilight Harbour - 256 340/400
Gnasty Gnorc - 445/500

Last edited by Morgan (Jul 18, 2016 2:26 PM)

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#18 Mar 11, 2016 5:08 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Interesting, I'd appreciate it if at any point during my videos when you see something that I may have missed that you can drop a comment. I feel like I got everything I could, so I am very eager to see what is possible to get that I missed with a bit of trying.

But don't post any comments on stuff I have missed just yet, as there's an episode that will be released at the end of the run, of stuff that I initially missed, but then went back and got.


-Oh and I'd also appreciate if you do not reveal your score for No Flame! Since that will spoil the series. Thanks!

Last edited by ManicX (Mar 11, 2016 5:11 PM)


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#19 Mar 11, 2016 6:58 PM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

ManicX wrote:

Interesting, I'd appreciate it if at any point during my videos when you see something that I may have missed that you can drop a comment. I feel like I got everything I could, so I am very eager to see what is possible to get that I missed with a bit of trying.

But don't post any comments on stuff I have missed just yet, as there's an episode that will be released at the end of the run, of stuff that I initially missed, but then went back and got.


-Oh and I'd also appreciate if you do not reveal your score for No Flame! Since that will spoil the series. Thanks!

Don't worry, I only started my no flame run earlier today, and I'm only on Peace Keepers.

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#20 Mar 13, 2016 5:40 PM

Spyronerd
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

I've done the no charge and no flame challenges. I think I pretty much fully optimised the no charge one. I did it with absolutely no charging, no exceptions. So that means no Gnasty Gnorc. But if in your rules it's allowed then I'll kill Gnasty still. As for no flame, I haven't fully optimised it, I think. I'll go back to it and defeat gnasty along with minor optimisation in certain levels.

So far to me it seems that no charge is surprisingly superior in terms of finding the most collectables. Though it's a more tedious challenge as you go slowly throughout each level. Plus you can get all gems in the flight levels with flame, yet only few with no flame.

Anyways I'll edit this post after I defeat Gnasty Gnorc on both challenges. From what I understand, you can only use charge or flame to your advantage IF it gets you to hit Gnasty Gnorc. No charging or flaming if it gives you other advantages, for example breaking metal chests in no charge, or charging the thieves in no charge I assume are prohibited. In which case I'm good :)

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#21 Mar 13, 2016 6:39 PM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Spyronerd wrote:

Plus you can get all gems in the flight levels with flame, yet only few with no flame.

Yes! Finally, someone else who realises this!

By the way, to anyone who's interested, I also finished the no flame challenge today.

Last edited by Morgan (Mar 13, 2016 6:43 PM)

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#22 Mar 13, 2016 10:33 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Glad this challenge got some people to try stuff out. I look forwards to when my final episode airs so you guys can comment your final scores on it.

Hidden text

Charging also prevents defeating most bosses as well as Speedways - so I think it more than evens the drawbacks of not being able to charge metal chests

And yes you are correct; chargin is only permitted to catch up to Gnorc so you can hit him. It cannot be used to get the thieves or other collectables.

I hope you guys agree that it was actually quite a fun way to play the game with the handicap.

If you want another challenge to try I recommend looking up RJWaters2's no gliding challenge! I was around when he did those and that's what inspired this challenge. It's pretty awesome.


>Oh and just a reminder; if you really cannot resist posting your scores right now; I'd appreciate it if you'd put them in a spoiler bracket - thanks!

Last edited by ManicX (Mar 13, 2016 10:45 PM)


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#23 Mar 15, 2016 9:42 PM

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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Nvm editting my other post. But my final scores for No-Charge:

Hidden text

Gems: 10127. Dragons: 78. Dragon eggs: 10
Total points: 31827

Artisans - 100/100 4/4
Stone Hill - 168/200 4/4 0/1
Dark Hollow - 100/100 3/3
Town Square - 160/200 4/4 1/1
Toasty - 97/100 1/1
Sunny Flight - 300/300

Peace Keepers - 190/200 3/3 1/1
Dry Canyon - 375/400 4/4 1/1
Cliff Town - 313/400 3/3 1/1
Ice Cavern - 319/400 5/5
Doctor Shemp - 268/300 1/1
Night Flight - 300/300

Magic Crafters - 228/300 3/3 2/2
Alpine Ridge - 427/500 4/4 1/1
High Caves - 411/500 3/3 2/2
Wizard Peak - 343/500 3/3 1/2
Blowhard - 345/400 1/1
Crystal Flight - 300/300

Beast Makers - 271/300 2/2
Terrace Village - 311/400 2/2
Misty Bog - 405/500 4/4
Tree Tops - 351/500 3/3
Metalhead - 440/500 1/1
Wild Flight - 300/300

Dream Weavers - 238/300 3/3
Dark Passage - 462/500 5/5
Lofty Castle - 400/400 3/3
Haunted Towers - 252/500 1/3
Jacques - 448/500 2/2
Icy Flight - 300/300

Gnorc Gnexus - 185/200 2/2
Gnorc Cove - 319/400 2/2
Twilight Harbour - 256/400 2/2
Gnasty Gnorc - 445/500


I found out how to get some extra gems in tree tops and wizard peak thanks to Morgan though. I was like ''how am I missing gems''. Experimented and got em. I'm curious though how you got certain other gems I didn't manage to obtain. I have a clue for some levels, likely the spinny chests. But for others I don't know. Also, Morgan, how did you get the

Hidden text

Stone Hill thief

?

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#24 Mar 16, 2016 11:45 AM

Morgan
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Spyronerd wrote:

Nvm editting my other post. But my final scores for No-Charge:

Hidden text

Gems: 10127. Dragons: 78. Dragon eggs: 10
Total points: 31827

Artisans - 100/100 4/4
Stone Hill - 168/200 4/4 0/1
Dark Hollow - 100/100 3/3
Town Square - 160/200 4/4 1/1
Toasty - 97/100 1/1
Sunny Flight - 300/300

Peace Keepers - 190/200 3/3 1/1
Dry Canyon - 375/400 4/4 1/1
Cliff Town - 313/400 3/3 1/1
Ice Cavern - 319/400 5/5
Doctor Shemp - 268/300 1/1
Night Flight - 300/300

Magic Crafters - 228/300 3/3 2/2
Alpine Ridge - 427/500 4/4 1/1
High Caves - 411/500 3/3 2/2
Wizard Peak - 343/500 3/3 1/2
Blowhard - 345/400 1/1
Crystal Flight - 300/300

Beast Makers - 271/300 2/2
Terrace Village - 311/400 2/2
Misty Bog - 405/500 4/4
Tree Tops - 351/500 3/3
Metalhead - 440/500 1/1
Wild Flight - 300/300

Dream Weavers - 238/300 3/3
Dark Passage - 462/500 5/5
Lofty Castle - 400/400 3/3
Haunted Towers - 252/500 1/3
Jacques - 448/500 2/2
Icy Flight - 300/300

Gnorc Gnexus - 185/200 2/2
Gnorc Cove - 319/400 2/2
Twilight Harbour - 256/400 2/2
Gnasty Gnorc - 445/500


I found out how to get some extra gems in tree tops and wizard peak thanks to Morgan though. I was like ''how am I missing gems''. Experimented and got em. I'm curious though how you got certain other gems I didn't manage to obtain. I have a clue for some levels, likely the spinny chests. But for others I don't know. Also, Morgan, how did you get the

Hidden text

Stone Hill thief

?

1. What percentage did you get?
2. In Misty Bog, I was able to get some help from the boars, and, by leaving the gems that the fan chests contain alone, and killing myself to make them respawn, and also by making the Gnorcs run into the fan chests' range, I was able to use the fan chests to kill all 6 of the Gnorcs that are on that bridge.
3. Coincidentally, I got the thief in Stone Hill the same way that ManicX did.
4. Did you get onto that platform with the gems on it in Lofty Castle by charging into the wall, and getting hit by an arrow? Because you're only allowed to do that to save time.
5. I have no idea how either of us managed to get more than 223 gems in Magic Crafters. I myself must've accidentally killed an armoured enemy, and got its gem without realising.
6. I have no idea how we both missed 26 and 16 possible gems in Alpine Ridge.
7. I have no idea how you managed to get 462 gems in Dark Passage.

Last edited by Morgan (Aug 21, 2017 10:15 AM)

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#25 Mar 16, 2016 4:57 PM

ManicX
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Re: Flame vs. Charge Challenge Run

Morgan wrote:

2. In Misty Bog, I was able to get some help from the boars, and, by leaving the gems that the fan chests contain alone, and killing myself to make them respawn, and also by making the Gnorcs run into the fan chests' range, I was able to use the fan chests to kill all 6 of the Gnorcs that are on that bridge.

Hmm I wish I had thought of this; I could have prolly nabbed an extra couple of gems - Although off the top of my head, I can only think of an extra 4 or 5 I could have gotten (one on Alpine Ridge, and a bunch on Misty Bog). The problem is that once you use the fan belts, there is no expermienting since they don't come back if you get the gem, so once I used it I really couldn't ask myself; "what if this works better...". I sort of just had to take a gamble. 

That's it, now I know this, I'll have to do a whole other re-run just to get those extra gems tongue!

-Charging is banned even for shortcuts. It's only the head jerk that is allowed. The head-jerk, which I say in Ep 1 is allowed; just not to open Metal Chests or defeat metal enemies (since that defeats the point) does get me a few extra gems from one location that otherwise would be unobtainable...

Episode 13 is in progress which is conveniently Misty Bog... all I can say is that level proves my disclaimer of me not being a Spyro Pro.

Last edited by ManicX (Mar 16, 2016 5:21 PM)


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