Ah, sorry. It's not really a 'limit'; it's just the amount of different locations for the clone worlds will appear. Keep travelling along one axis through 65,355 worlds and you'll just return to the first one (Spyro's coordinate on that axis will actually wrap around halfway along the journey).

Edit: Although it's worth noting, the game will crash at some point along the way. I can't explain why that happens, the simplest explanation is that the game really isn't designed to let you go that far and something will inevitably break!

This is extremely late, but, hypothetically speaking, could you get to an otherwise unreachable part of a level after several years?

Morgan wrote:

LXShadow wrote:

Ah, sorry. It's not really a 'limit'; it's just the amount of different locations for the clone worlds will appear. Keep travelling along one axis through 65,355 worlds and you'll just return to the first one (Spyro's coordinate on that axis will actually wrap around halfway along the journey).

Edit: Although it's worth noting, the game will crash at some point along the way. I can't explain why that happens, the simplest explanation is that the game really isn't designed to let you go that far and something will inevitably break!

I've never been able to reach a clone world without the game crashing. I'll be able to get to one of them in Spyro 1 if I actually bother to do the zombie mode glitch and fall off the level.

if you have the game on your computer (and i seem to recall you saying that) did you try CheatEngine or a program like that? once you isolate the value for Spyro's height (it's not that hard, i could explain if you want) just change it to a higher value. i've gotten up much farther that way than i ever could on an actual PlayStation.

I never said anything about playing my games on an emulator.

LXShadow wrote:

Ah, sorry. It's not really a 'limit'; it's just the amount of different locations for the clone worlds will appear. Keep travelling along one axis through 65,355 worlds and you'll just return to the first one (Spyro's coordinate on that axis will actually wrap around halfway along the journey).

Edit: Although it's worth noting, the game will crash at some point along the way. I can't explain why that happens, the simplest explanation is that the game really isn't designed to let you go that far and something will inevitably break!

I've never been able to reach a clone world without the game crashing. I'll be able to get to one of them in Spyro 1 if I actually bother to do the zombie mode glitch and fall off the level.

if you have the game on your computer (and i seem to recall you saying that) did you try CheatEngine or a program like that? once you isolate the value for Spyro's height (it's not that hard, i could explain if you want) just change it to a higher value. i've gotten up much farther that way than i ever could on an actual PlayStation.

Ah, sorry. It's not really a 'limit'; it's just the amount of different locations for the clone worlds will appear. Keep travelling along one axis through 65,355 worlds and you'll just return to the first one (Spyro's coordinate on that axis will actually wrap around halfway along the journey).

Edit: Although it's worth noting, the game will crash at some point along the way. I can't explain why that happens, the simplest explanation is that the game really isn't designed to let you go that far and something will inevitably break!

I've never been able to reach a clone world without the game crashing. I'll be able to get to one of them in Spyro 1 if I actually bother to do the zombie mode glitch and fall off the level.

Edit: Although it's worth noting, the game will crash at some point along the way. I can't explain why that happens, the simplest explanation is that the game really isn't designed to let you go that far and something will inevitably break!

Nah, I just mean that for example, if the real world is at 00000000 X, 00000000 Y and 00000000 Z, then there's another world at 00010000 X, 00000000 Y, 00000000 Z (hexadecimal--so 10000 is 65536). Continue that with every possible combination of 10000's for each coordinate, and unless I'm mistaken, it's something like 281 trillion worlds. One heck of a lot for sure!

I asked you what you thought would happen when the world limit was exceeded. Would they just stop appearing?

36IStillLikeSpyro36 wrote:

LXShadow wrote:

Ohh okay. Well Spyro's coordinates don't wrap around, it's just that the level renderer reads it as though they do.

but in general, don't they wrap around eventually, though? because, at least in Spyro 3, i did the swim-in-air glitch once and just kept going up, and up, and up (i had Cheat Engine up and i'd swim up for a little bit, and then change the value of Spyro's height by several million) and when i got to... i think about 2 billion or something? Spyro died like he does when you fall into a chasm.

You're right, sorry I wasn't clear. A wraparound does still apply (at around 2 billion, yeah), but it's massive and won't happen in practice until you've spent several days swimming up through thousands of clone worlds. =P Clone worlds are worth mentioning because they'll wrap around after a few minutes of travel.

Morgan wrote:

Spyro's collisions aren't always ignored when he goes through a portal. Watch a speedrun of the game, and you'll see that they go into Crystal Flight, apparently without rescuing Boldar, yet when they exit Crystal Flight, Boldar's been rescued. This is because they entered Crystal Flight from behind, and it takes so long for the camera to wrap around the arch that Spyro actually touches Boldar, therefore rescuing him. Sometimes, you might even see the flash that comes from rescuing a dragon before the loading screen appears. However, the game doesn't cancel loading the level, which is why every competent speedrunner uses it to save time.

They aren't? o.o Maybe it's just the scenery collision then? Another theory is that the objects in the level check their own collision with Spyro--rather than Spyro checking his collision with them--and the objects don't tend to care if he's flying through a portal at the time.

Either the way, hopefully we've cleared up everything about the clone worlds. It's still funny to think that there's 281 trillion of them. We're never going to see them all in this dimension. =P

Do you mean that the worlds can only wrap around 281,000,000,000,000 times? What do you think would happen if the worlds wrapped around any more times?

LXShadow wrote:

Ohh okay. Well Spyro's coordinates don't wrap around, it's just that the level renderer reads it as though they do.

but in general, don't they wrap around eventually, though? because, at least in Spyro 3, i did the swim-in-air glitch once and just kept going up, and up, and up (i had Cheat Engine up and i'd swim up for a little bit, and then change the value of Spyro's height by several million) and when i got to... i think about 2 billion or something? Spyro died like he does when you fall into a chasm.

You're right, sorry I wasn't clear. A wraparound does still apply (at around 2 billion, yeah), but it's massive and won't happen in practice until you've spent several days swimming up through thousands of clone worlds. =P Clone worlds are worth mentioning because they'll wrap around after a few minutes of travel.

They aren't? o.o Maybe it's just the scenery collision then? Another theory is that the objects in the level check their own collision with Spyro--rather than Spyro checking his collision with them--and the objects don't tend to care if he's flying through a portal at the time.

Either the way, hopefully we've cleared up everything about the clone worlds. It's still funny to think that there's 281 trillion of them. We're never going to see them all in this dimension. =P

Ohh okay. Well Spyro's coordinates don't wrap around, it's just that the level renderer reads it as though they do.

Right, well I reckon when Spyro goes through a portal, his collisions are ignored. This makes sense because we don't want him crashing face-first into whatever's behind the portal =P

In zombie mode I think the game will notice most triggers that the programmers felt it needs to. That would be mostly death triggers, and anything else that could cause a lock if Spyro were to hit them while dead.

Spyro's collisions aren't always ignored when he goes through a portal. Watch a speedrun of the game, and you'll see that they go into Crystal Flight, apparently without rescuing Boldar, yet when they exit Crystal Flight, Boldar's been rescued. This is because they entered Crystal Flight from behind, and it takes so long for the camera to wrap around the arch that Spyro actually touches Boldar, therefore rescuing him. Sometimes, you might even see the flash that comes from rescuing a dragon before the loading screen appears. However, the game doesn't cancel loading the level, which is why every competent speedrunner uses it to save time.

Ohh okay. Well Spyro's coordinates don't wrap around, it's just that the level renderer reads it as though they do.

but in general, don't they wrap around eventually, though? because, at least in Spyro 3, i did the swim-in-air glitch once and just kept going up, and up, and up (i had Cheat Engine up and i'd swim up for a little bit, and then change the value of Spyro's height by several million) and when i got to... i think about 2 billion or something? Spyro died like he does when you fall into a chasm.

Right, well I reckon when Spyro goes through a portal, his collisions are ignored. This makes sense because we don't want him crashing face-first into whatever's behind the portal =P

In zombie mode I think the game will notice most triggers that the programmers felt it needs to. That would be mostly death triggers, and anything else that could cause a lock if Spyro were to hit them while dead.

Not quite sure what you mean by roll over? To be clear, nothing changes when you go too high. It's just that the renderer doesn't interpret the level scenery correctly. The level scenery isn't actually there, it's just that the renderer can't tell the difference between viewing the level from e.g. 140,648,294 and viewing it from 1140,648,294 (simplified example). The renderer doesn't have that problem with understanding the coordinates of the objects and Spyro. I can't actually confirm why that is, but it's probably an optimisation where the rendering code prefers to transform the scenery using 2 byte ints instead of 4 byte ints.

When you say Spyro's coordinates roll over, do you just mean when you reach the clone world? Spyro's coordinates actualy work fine, and will travel the whole four-byte range (-2 billion to 2 billion). It's just the renderer that doesn't really get it. =P

I checked out a video of the glitch you mentioned. It's just classic zombie mode. Most likely the game notices all the triggers, it just thinks you're dead, so it doesn't bother killing you. It'd be annoying if, after you take a hit and died, enemies could take advantage and keep hitting you in an endless cycle of pain and suffering

I didn't know about the horizontal death triggers. Cool! Guess Insomniac were worried that players would somehow make it that far. They were right perhaps--but to be honest, if the player can make it that far, then there are far bigger problems at hand =P

For Spyro's co-ordinates, I meant when they roll over from 65535 to 1 on the Y-axis. For the glitch that I mentioned, I meant how Spyro flies through the ground. Also, the fact that the game actually notices most triggers, instead of only a couple of them, when you're in zombie mode with Sparx raises more questions about the glitch.

When you say Spyro's coordinates roll over, do you just mean when you reach the clone world? Spyro's coordinates actualy work fine, and will travel the whole four-byte range (-2 billion to 2 billion). It's just the renderer that doesn't really get it. =P

I checked out a video of the glitch you mentioned. It's just classic zombie mode. Most likely the game notices all the triggers, it just thinks you're dead, so it doesn't bother killing you. It'd be annoying if, after you take a hit and died, enemies could take advantage and keep hitting you in an endless cycle of pain and suffering

I didn't know about the horizontal death triggers. Cool! Guess Insomniac were worried that players would somehow make it that far. They were right perhaps--but to be honest, if the player can make it that far, then there are far bigger problems at hand =P